Duda de base sobre las rutinas fullbody

[Sebasbil]

Aupa:
Llevo bastante tiempo con rutina fullbody (ABA, BAB). Mi duda "teórica" es la siguiente. Por definición, en una rutina fullbody trabajamos con ejercicios "básicos". Por otro lado, se aconseja, cada cierto tiempo (2-3 meses) cambiar de rutina para que le cuerpo no se acomode. El problema que veo es que poco se podrá cambiar si debemos ceñirnos a esos ejercicios "básicos". Por ejemplo. si hago para pecho press de banca, en un cambio de rutina sustituyo un ejercicio tan "básico", ¿por cual? No sé si me explico. El caso es que cuando miro rutinas fullbody para cambiar casi siempre aparecen los mismos ejercicios, cosa lógica por otra parte.

Gracias y un saludo

[efe]

A mí me pasa igual. Cuando intento construir una rutina diferente siempre acabo con los mismos ejercicios.
Ahora lo que hago es pensar en materiales diferentes:
Barra
Peso Corporal
Gomas
Máquinas
Anillas
Pesa Rusa

... si hago para pecho press de banca, en un cambio de rutina sustituyo un ejercicio tan "básico", ¿por cual? ..

Flexiones con lastre

[cyberclon]

A mí me pasa igual. Cuando intento construir una rutina diferente siempre acabo con los mismos ejercicios.

Cosa completamente logica. Si estas construyendo dos rutinas para el mismo objetivo y la misma persona, lo normal es que sean iguales o practicamente iguales.

Lo de cambiar de rutina cada 2 o 3 meses no se sustenta en nada, y mucho menos si hablamos de una rutina de fuerza. Si el objetivo se mantiene y tenemos que seguir trabajando las mismas capacidades no hay ningun motivo para cambiar de rutina. Como ya he comentado hace poco, el principal problema es que no planificamos hacia un objetivo concreto, nuestro objetivo es "ir al gym", y entonces todo hace aguas.

[BHOPFAN]

puedes cambiar rutina sin cambiar ejercicios, y no tiene porque acomodarse el cuerpo si hay cambios en intensidades, series, descansos, tempo,... de todas manera es importante tener unas alternativas de cada movimiento o variaciones del ejercicio principal.

dominante de rodilla: para la sentadilla trasera tienes sentadilla frontal, sentadilla bulgara, sentadilla a una pierna, zancada, ....

dominante de cadera: para el peso muerto convencional tienes peso muerto con barra hexagonal, peso muerto rumano, peso muerto a una pierna,...

empujon tren superior: para el press de banca tienes press de banca agarre neutro con mancuernas, flexiones con peso, o http://www.benbruno.com/2013/01/unilate ... ariations/

[DAMARPO]

Por definición

Pues es mala definición esa que dices, y es normal que te lleve a pensar lo que comentas...

cada cierto tiempo (2-3 meses) cambiar de rutina

No, de rutina no, variar el estímulo.

dominante de rodilla....dominante de cadera

uy uy uy...veo debate muy interesante si nos metemos en esto

[Tuto]

uy uy uy...veo debate muy interesante si nos metemos en esto

Pues si... aquí estaremos para tomar nota.

[BHOPFAN]

uy uy uy...veo debate muy interesante si nos metemos en esto

ciertamente. por decirlos asi, no puede ser igual de dominante de rodilla una sentadilla trasera que una frontal, o no puede ser igual de dominante de cadera un peso muerto convencional que con un peso muerto con barra hexagonal. pero pienso la clasificacion esta bien para organizar rutinas aunque sabiendo cada ejercicio que hace dentro del conjunto.

dejo un trozo de este articulo para abrir debate http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_art ... opment&cr=

[spoiler]Stop Talking about Patterns!

The problem with the whole quad versus hip dominant argument surfaces when you name a movement (i.e., the squat) and then try to force it into a quad or hip dominant category.

Coming back to our front squat versus box squat debate, they're both squatting exercises by name, but the end-result (and muscles trained) are vastly different.

Instead of focusing so much on the name, look at what the movement is doing – or what position the body is in – and you'll have a much clearer perspective on what you're trying to accomplish.

One way is to look at the position of the tibia. While Stuart McGill is famous for coining the term "neutral spine," Charlie Weingroff is the first person I've heard use the term "vertical tibia."

Gray Cook took it a step further (at least for me) when he talked about vertical versus angled tibia exercises. If your goal is to build your glutes and hamstrings, your goal should be to keep your tibia as vertical as possible.

On the opposite side of the spectrum, think about what happens when you have a very angled tibia position.

When those knees get out over those toes, believe it or not, God doesn't kill kittens. No, when you get into an angled tibia position, you put far more stress on the quads (or anterior chain) than you do on the posterior chain.

Here's another way to think about it. If you don't like talking about the tibia, consider what happens to the torso instead, because they often go hand-in-hand.

If your torso is very bent-over, you're going to load the hips/hamstrings more; if your torso is upright, you're going to load the quadriceps more.

Now if you take those definitions, you can make a lot more sense out of those squatting variations. In a front squat, you're typically very upright through the torso and the tibia gets very angled. This is the definition of a pure quad dominant exercise.

On the other end of the spectrum, you have a box squat where you're trying to keep the tibia very vertical. As a result, you're forced to sit way back, and lean the torso forward. This is the definition of a pure hip dominant exercise.

Maybe these definitions will help a bit:

Angled Torso + Vertical Tibiae = Hip Dominant

Vertical Torso + Angled Tibiae = Quad Dominant

But can we go too far with these in our programming?

At least in the case of angled tibia work, I think so.

Angled Tibiae – When Good Knees Go Bad

Traditional thinking says that if getting the knees over the toes (like you would in a front squat, or Olympic-style back squat) is good, getting them even further is better.

Not so fast.

I think a line needs to be drawn in the sand, and that line begins and ends when you exhaust normal mobility through the foot and ankle joints.

If you've been around bodybuilding long enough, you've likely seen bodybuilders perform quad dominant exercises where their rear foot is actually coming off the ground, so as to allow the knee to shoot ever farther and farther forward.

Here's the rub: the more you let those knees glide over the toes, the more compressive forces you place on the patello-femoral joint. While this may be awesome for building huge friggin' quads, I'd argue that it's going to put a serious limitation on your long-term training goals.

Quite simply, unless you're a total freakazoid or have cartilage made out of concrete, you're not going perform exercises in this fashion for long without breaking down.

If your goal is to build huge quads while simultaneously training as long as possible, front squats are the end of the road. In a front squat, you get all the quad-building benefits from angled tibia work while minimizing the ridiculous compressive loads you get when you start to drive the knee excessively over the toe.

This is also why so many lay trainees still believe the myth that the knee shouldn't travel over the toe when lifting/squatting.

First, watch any baby squat and their form and alignment is impeccable. The knee travels over the toe and they can camp out there for days while playing with a toy, pulling your hair, or even whistling Dixie.

But watch the average sedentary adult squat down and their heels come up, the knees shoot forward, and they bellyache about how squatting hurts their knees.

I'm quickly reminded of my favorite Dan John quote of all time:

"Squatting doesn't hurt your knees – how you're squatting is hurting your knees!"

Now that we have all that cleared up, let's examine how we can use this knowledge to create a superior training program.

Programming

Rather than give you a cookie cutter program, I'm going to give you some principles that will really benefit your training.

Here's a table that depicts both quad and hip dominant exercises, along with the ever-popular grey area:

Quad Dominant : Front Squats, Olympic Style Back Squats, Bulgarian Split-Squats, Split-Squats, Lunges

Grey Area : Powerlifting Back Squats, Sumo Deadlifts

Hip Dominant : Conventional Deadlifts, Romanian Deadlifts, Powerlifting Box Squats, Pull-Throughs, Hip Thrusts, Rack Pulls, Single-Leg Romanian Deadlifts

Now keep in mind, virtually all of these exercises can be moved from one section to another. If you conventional deadlift and you start with your knees 2 inches in front of the bar, it's no longer as hip dominant as it should be.

Or if you do a box squat but your torso is bolt upright, it's going to be more quad dominant than usual. At the end of the day, it all comes down to execution. From a programming perspective when you're starting out, you probably need a ton of hip dominant work.

Gray Cook often talks about performing four times as much volume for the deadlift versus the squat. Another favorite quote from Gray is that "You build the deadlift, and maintain the squat pattern."

And I totally get what he's saying – the quads are typically strong to begin with, why make them stronger? Instead, focus on the weak link.

But that little voice in the back of my mind, and the strength athlete that lies in my heart, always wants me to push my squat up, too![/spoiler]

[juan weider]

Sebasbil.

No es tan complicado como tú lo ves, no hace falta cambiar de rutina cada 2-3 meses mientras haya resultados! Si algo va bien por qué cambiar?

Sobre sustituir un ejercicio por otro con el mismo objetivo no hay ningún problema, incluso es motivador e interesante. Veamos cual podrían ser esos ejercicios como opción:

Press banca barra = press mancuerna.
Press sup, man. = press barra
Sentadilla trasera = frontal - pistol.
Peso muerto = rumano - sumo - snatch
Dominadas = pronas - supinas - neutras.
Press militar barra = mancuerna - sentado - a 1 mano.
Remo yates = pendlay - mancuernas.

Tambien se puede variar el ancho de agarre, velocidad de ejecución, tiempo de descanso, en fin, hay muchas posibilidades y opciones que sin cambiar de rutina ésta sea distinta.

Slds.

[Tuto]

dejo un trozo de este articulo para abrir debate http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_art ... opment&cr=

Muy interesante esta visión de obtener un estímulo diferente.

Pero se cumple el sentido estricto de la palabra 'hip-dominant' o sólo es que se percibe un mayor o menor estímulo en isquios y glúteos, dominando siempre el cuádriceps en mayor o menor medida?